Arcadius · Nov 11, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58

One thing i haven't been able to find out is that what does one loose out with the secondary profession. Is there a certain skill that you do not get for the profession because it's secondary?

For ex. I would start a warrior then my secondary would be a monk. My intent for using the warrior would be for his armor capabilities, but i would be playing the monk. Would i not have a certain skill available to me for the monk class because it's secondary?

Knightsaber Sith · Nov 11, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04

an attribute

dervish primary attribute is mysticism, try to use any of the avatar elites as a secondary dervish and they'll only last a second

ele is energy storage

Tark Alkerk · Nov 11, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04

you wound't lose any skills but you would lose an monk atrribute called divine favour which comes in useful when monking also 4 pips of energy regen is useful to also you can't apply secondary proffession runes to your armour.

LightningHell · Nov 11, 2006, 08:05 AM // 08:05

You lose out on: Runes, Armor (Insignias), Primary Attribute, and Energy Regeneration, off the top of my head.

Your W/Mo would only be able to hit 12 in Healing Prayers/Protection Prayers, you lose out on Divine Favor (still have the skills but nowhere near as effective), and you only have 2 Energy regeneration.

VGJustice · Nov 11, 2006, 08:07 AM // 08:07

It's not so much losing out on something so much as not having access to somethng that only the primary profesion would have: The primary Attribute.

IIRC, it's: Warrior - Strength, Ranger - Expertise, Elementalist - Energy Storage, Mesmer - Fast Casting, Necromancer - Soul Reaping, Monk - Divine Favor, Ritualist - Spawning Power, Assassin - Critical Strikes, Dirvish - Mysticism, Paragon - Leadership

But like I said, you don't lose anything. You just don't have access to any of the ones that are not your primary profession.

=HT=Ingram · Nov 11, 2006, 09:31 AM // 09:31

I kinda miss that we could DUMP the secondary and be a PURE character build. I mean lets face it ... How many monks you know that makes use of their secondary? I hardy ever use any attrib on my 2nd prof, and like it when I make a PvP and get those out of the way... Its just more extra stuff to look through when developing a build that actually is a PURE build. A few of my heroes I refuse to add a 2ndary too, cause I can no longer get rid of it later as we did in the NPE.

Bankai · Nov 11, 2006, 09:49 AM // 09:49

There are 2 things that make it bad to play a monk on another profession.

First is max energy and energy regeneration. The max energy of a warrior is 20, from a monk is 35. This is a huge difference. You have a much bigger reserve of energy. However, what's even more important, a monk gains energy twice as fast as a warrior. So you're out of energy much quicker and you have to wait twice as long to gain it back. Furthermore, the monk has the primary attribute divine favour which adds healing on top of the normal healing. This means that you heal for about 40 more hp every heal. That means 1 orison, or 5 energy less. So you have much better energy management.

lightblade · Nov 11, 2006, 10:02 AM // 10:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram

I kinda miss that we could DUMP the secondary and be a PURE character build. I mean lets face it ... How many monks you know that makes use of their secondary? I hardy ever use any attrib on my 2nd prof, and like it when I make a PvP and get those out of the way... Its just more extra stuff to look through when developing a build that actually is a PURE build. A few of my heroes I refuse to add a 2ndary too, cause I can no longer get rid of it later as we did in the NPE.

If you don't know how to take advantage of your secondary profession, then I'm sorry...you're character's power just got reduced by 33%.

- There's many monks uses mesmer secondary to regain energy. Many more monks use elementist secondary to make use of all the glyphs. Many bonders uses mesmer's mantra of inscription to speed up blessed signet's energy gain so that they may keep more enchantment on others.
- Many warriors uses necromancer secondary to make use of plague touch to get rid of blind, yet many more uses elementist's shock for knocking down people.
- My current necromancer MM hero build uses elementist secondary to use glyph of lesser energy to ease that 25 energy from bone fiend.
- My mesmer counter abaddon build that can be found in the mesmer forum make uses of Paragon secondary's Cautury Signet

That's right off the top of my head.

Haggard · Nov 11, 2006, 11:20 AM // 11:20

I'm a bit simple and generally (for PvE) use builds composed of one profession. However I'll sometimes get a secondary for a hard res - but in PvP it becomes an entirely different. You need to have skills that will counter the human aspect of the enemy in order to allow your primary profession to reach its full potential.

Admael · Nov 11, 2006, 11:32 AM // 11:32

A few things. Primary profession attribute, runes, armor level, energy and energy regeneration.

Thom Bangalter · Nov 11, 2006, 01:06 PM // 13:06

you lose playability and functionality by trying to monk on a warrior primary.

Arcadius · Nov 11, 2006, 01:19 PM // 13:19

Thank you all for the responces =).

dansamy · Nov 11, 2006, 10:53 PM // 22:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram

I kinda miss that we could DUMP the secondary and be a PURE character build. I mean lets face it ... How many monks you know that makes use of their secondary? I hardy ever use any attrib on my 2nd prof, and like it when I make a PvP and get those out of the way... Its just more extra stuff to look through when developing a build that actually is a PURE build. A few of my heroes I refuse to add a 2ndary too, cause I can no longer get rid of it later as we did in the NPE.

All of the monks that I know utilize their secondary profession for energy management or kiting skills.

=HT=Ingram · Nov 12, 2006, 09:59 AM // 09:59

If they have energy problems that's their problem, not mine. I have none... But if you like your 2nds great, on my monk well I just don't see any need for it.

Its just another option. Some builds are pathetic without the help from a secondary prof to help it out... Others are not...

Xenex Xclame · Nov 12, 2006, 04:45 PM // 16:45

I think its best you stop right there before you make a fool of yourself Ingram.

About secondary usage on pure characters , in pvp ( i dont know why you would go pure here but whatever) just having a secondary and not have any skills of that class may cause a bit of extra advantage.

If you were a e/mo for example , people would think you have heal party , while in fact in this pure build you dont have it , so someone might be waiting for you to throw heal party up, well... they might be waiting a while.

Its simple if i saw a player that is pure W, i know he cant get rid of conditions, if he was a w/mo, w/n etc, i woudnt know this .

dansamy · Nov 12, 2006, 11:47 PM // 23:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by =HT=Ingram

If they have energy problems that's their problem, not mine. I have none... But if you like your 2nds great, on my monk well I just don't see any need for it.

Its just another option. Some builds are pathetic without the help from a secondary prof to help it out... Others are not...

You amuse me.

hopefulliness · Nov 13, 2006, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

The max energy of a warrior is 20, from a monk is 35. much better energy .

Actually, my war has 30 energy

hopefulliness · Nov 13, 2006, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bankai

The max energy of a warrior is 20, from a monk is 35. much better energy .

Actually, my war has 30 energy

pingu666 · Nov 13, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53

half the regen would just cripple you, and with lack of devine favour ud be needing to cast more often, further cripple.

i think the only professions where you should even consider a monk healing build would be e/mo and n/mo. these 2 have 1)energy storage 2)soul reaping, so you can spam out the heals. a possible is me/mo using me skills to get energy, but often ull be down to 5E, and haveto use orison to save someone.

ritulist profession has a good healing line too. really if you wish to play monk, pick monk as your primary. or ritulist.

dansamy · Nov 13, 2006, 01:12 AM // 01:12

I've played ElMo healer before as well in areas of the game where live monks are in short supply and Mhenlo is too stupid to be of any use. (Thank god for better AI.) ElMo can power out the healing for a looong time, which you'll need to do since ElMo has no DF bonus.

Nov 11, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58	#1
Arcadius Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Nov 2006	What exactly does one loose out on with the Sec. profession One thing i haven't been able to find out is that what does one loose out with the secondary profession. Is there a certain skill that you do not get for the profession because it's secondary? For ex. I would start a warrior then my secondary would be a monk. My intent for using the warrior would be for his armor capabilities, but i would be playing the monk. Would i not have a certain skill available to me for the monk class because it's secondary?

Nov 11, 2006, 08:05 AM // 08:05	#4
LightningHell (????????????)??? Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Hong Kong Guild: Guildless Profession: Mo/	You lose out on: Runes, Armor (Insignias), Primary Attribute, and Energy Regeneration, off the top of my head. Your W/Mo would only be able to hit 12 in Healing Prayers/Protection Prayers, you lose out on Divine Favor (still have the skills but nowhere near as effective), and you only have 2 Energy regeneration. __________________

Nov 11, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04	#2
Knightsaber Sith Furnace Stoker Join Date: Aug 2006 Guild: Few Fallen Heroes [FFH] Profession: W/E	an attribute dervish primary attribute is mysticism, try to use any of the avatar elites as a secondary dervish and they'll only last a second ele is energy storage

Nov 11, 2006, 08:04 AM // 08:04	#3
Tark Alkerk Krytan Explorer Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In a Black Hole Guild: less Profession: E/	you wound't lose any skills but you would lose an monk atrribute called divine favour which comes in useful when monking also 4 pips of energy regen is useful to also you can't apply secondary proffession runes to your armour.

Nov 11, 2006, 08:07 AM // 08:07	#5
VGJustice Desert Nomad Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Tyria, cappin' ur bosses Guild: Boston Guild [BG] Profession: R/W	It's not so much losing out on something so much as not having access to somethng that only the primary profesion would have: The primary Attribute. IIRC, it's: Warrior - Strength, Ranger - Expertise, Elementalist - Energy Storage, Mesmer - Fast Casting, Necromancer - Soul Reaping, Monk - Divine Favor, Ritualist - Spawning Power, Assassin - Critical Strikes, Dirvish - Mysticism, Paragon - Leadership But like I said, you don't lose anything. You just don't have access to any of the ones that are not your primary profession.

Nov 11, 2006, 09:31 AM // 09:31	#6
=HT=Ingram Forge Runner Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Anchorage Alaska Guild: Haz Team [HT] Profession: R/W	I kinda miss that we could DUMP the secondary and be a PURE character build. I mean lets face it ... How many monks you know that makes use of their secondary? I hardy ever use any attrib on my 2nd prof, and like it when I make a PvP and get those out of the way... Its just more extra stuff to look through when developing a build that actually is a PURE build. A few of my heroes I refuse to add a 2ndary too, cause I can no longer get rid of it later as we did in the NPE.

Nov 11, 2006, 09:49 AM // 09:49	#7
Bankai Desert Nomad Join Date: Sep 2006 Guild: Bubblegum Dragons Profession: Mo/E	There are 2 things that make it bad to play a monk on another profession. First is max energy and energy regeneration. The max energy of a warrior is 20, from a monk is 35. This is a huge difference. You have a much bigger reserve of energy. However, what's even more important, a monk gains energy twice as fast as a warrior. So you're out of energy much quicker and you have to wait twice as long to gain it back. Furthermore, the monk has the primary attribute divine favour which adds healing on top of the normal healing. This means that you heal for about 40 more hp every heal. That means 1 orison, or 5 energy less. So you have much better energy management.

Nov 11, 2006, 11:20 AM // 11:20	#9
Haggard Desert Nomad Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Urmston, Manchester, UK Guild: Greener Pastures [DVDF] Profession: W/Rt	I'm a bit simple and generally (for PvE) use builds composed of one profession. However I'll sometimes get a secondary for a hard res - but in PvP it becomes an entirely different. You need to have skills that will counter the human aspect of the enemy in order to allow your primary profession to reach its full potential.

Nov 11, 2006, 11:32 AM // 11:32	#10
Admael Krytan Explorer Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: California Guild: Xen of Heroes	A few things. Primary profession attribute, runes, armor level, energy and energy regeneration.

Nov 11, 2006, 01:06 PM // 13:06	#11
Thom Bangalter Grindin' Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: MO Profession: E/Mo	you lose playability and functionality by trying to monk on a warrior primary.

Nov 11, 2006, 01:19 PM // 13:19	#12
Arcadius Pre-Searing Cadet Join Date: Nov 2006	Thank you all for the responces =).

Nov 12, 2006, 09:59 AM // 09:59	#14
=HT=Ingram Forge Runner Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Anchorage Alaska Guild: Haz Team [HT] Profession: R/W	If they have energy problems that's their problem, not mine. I have none... But if you like your 2nds great, on my monk well I just don't see any need for it. Its just another option. Some builds are pathetic without the help from a secondary prof to help it out... Others are not...

Nov 12, 2006, 04:45 PM // 16:45	#15
Xenex Xclame Desert Nomad Join Date: Mar 2006 Guild: DPX Profession: R/	I think its best you stop right there before you make a fool of yourself Ingram. About secondary usage on pure characters , in pvp ( i dont know why you would go pure here but whatever) just having a secondary and not have any skills of that class may cause a bit of extra advantage. If you were a e/mo for example , people would think you have heal party , while in fact in this pure build you dont have it , so someone might be waiting for you to throw heal party up, well... they might be waiting a while. Its simple if i saw a player that is pure W, i know he cant get rid of conditions, if he was a w/mo, w/n etc, i woudnt know this .

Nov 13, 2006, 12:53 AM // 00:53	#19
pingu666 Jungle Guide Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: guildhall Guild: [DETH]	half the regen would just cripple you, and with lack of devine favour ud be needing to cast more often, further cripple. i think the only professions where you should even consider a monk healing build would be e/mo and n/mo. these 2 have 1)energy storage 2)soul reaping, so you can spam out the heals. a possible is me/mo using me skills to get energy, but often ull be down to 5E, and haveto use orison to save someone. ritulist profession has a good healing line too. really if you wish to play monk, pick monk as your primary. or ritulist.

Nov 13, 2006, 01:12 AM // 01:12	#20
dansamy Chasing Dragons Join Date: May 2005 Location: Lost in La-La Land Guild: LFGuild Profession: Mo/Me	I've played ElMo healer before as well in areas of the game where live monks are in short supply and Mhenlo is too stupid to be of any use. (Thank god for better AI.) ElMo can power out the healing for a looong time, which you'll need to do since ElMo has no DF bonus.